| General Relationship Discussion Although anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage, this section is for people interested in general relationship and marriage advice. |
Today, 06:30 AM
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#1 (permalink)
| | Registered User ?Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 5
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We are a couple in our 20's, have known each other 4-5 years, and been a couple for about 2 years. We are best friends, super compatible, and happy together. We've known we wanted to be married since the beginning of our relationship. But issues keep coming up about his female friends that cause me a lot of pain and put strain on our relationship, and I'm very confused. Are these friendships appropriate in our case? Should we be doing something differently?This is my first relationship, so a lot of my feelings are new and confusing. However, I have come to a few firm conclusions about myself. I am not an insecure, jealous, or controlling person. I also trust completely that he would never cheat or intend anything unfaithful. I want him to be able to have female friends if that's possible. I want to add to his life, not take away from it. I would feel bad if he had to give up any friendships, especially his old high school friendships from before we met. Here is what I have come up with. Pros for him having female friends: -He grew up among sisters, and has always maintained friendships with females because he feels more comfortable with it.
-He prefers female friends because he's found that they make better friends. Male friends seem to care more about his entertainment value than anything deeper.
-He doesn't consider it a friendship unless there is considerable depth to the relationship. Anything else is just acquaintanceship, which doesn't interest him.
-He's not in it for his ego (to be flattered by female attention), he just seeks meaningful platonic friendships, which are easier for him to find in females.
-The first thing he tells new female friends when he meets them is that he is in a happy relationship, he is looking for a platonic friend only, and if that is not her intention too, they can't be friends. Cons for him having female friends: -He doesn't have a good sense of appropriate boundaries, or why they should exist. He treats and is treated by his female friends exactly the same as a romantic partner, except that there is no holding hands/kissing/sex. There are no other physical or emotional boundaries.
-We have tried to put some boundaries in place to see if it helps, with little success. They feel so unnatural to him, he forgets how to act, and why he should act that way. He simply doesn't pick up on all the subtleties (even the UNsubtleties) that should prompt boundaries.
-He is very caring and generous by nature, which is wonderful, but often causes female friends to become too dependent on him. He discusses deep personal topics with female friends, offers a lot of advice, helps them with their problems, and serves as a shoulder to cry on. He says that women often confide and vent to him about their personal problems, especially their current relationships or exes. He is also often asked to help them move, fix their belongings, escort them or pick them up from dangerous areas. These things have no deeper meaning to him than just being nice. So he often finds himself in female friendships where he is much more important to her than she is to him.
-He's really innocent. He is oblivious to flirtation and other signs of sexual or romantic interest unless they are very, and I mean VERY, overt. He does not catch hints. He does not read between lines. He does not pick up clues. He doesn't realize a woman is interested or developing interest unless she makes it very obvious, usually an actual verbal confession. Two separate times as a teenager, two different girls have "broken up" with him while he had no idea they were even a couple. He is utterly clueless, and knows this about himself.
-He has female friends from before we met, but also new female friends from after the start of our relationship. None of these female friends have made any attempt to befriend me, even after he continually suggests that they befriend me. I have also tried to make opportunities for them to talk to me. I would like to be friends with them. Our only mutual female friends are ones I knew first, or ones we both met before we were in a relationship.
-He has been actively, and independently, seeking new female friends throughout our relationship. He doesn't try to keep me from these friends or hide them in any way, but it is nearly impossible for me to physically go hang out with them or bring them to our place, for reasons beyond our control right now.
-I am positive that at least some of his female friends have feelings for him. He rarely believes me when I try to warn him that his "friend" doesn't fit the proper role of a friend anymore, even though my suspicions have been dramatically revealed correct before, which makes me feel like my input is being invalidated and unfairly dismissed.
-I am hurt by this perpetual situation. The lack of boundaries does bother me a great deal. It doesn't seem proper. The physical closeness and contact just seems wrong to me. He has successfully toned that down a great deal with his newer friends because he recognized that it gives female friends the wrong idea. But he reverts right back to his old ways when he sees his old friends, out of habit and their reinforcement. The emotional intimacy also seems very inappropriate. And the exclusivity especially bothers me. I feel like our relationship is not being honored and respected, by both him and his female friends.
-I am worried for the female friends, because if they do have feelings for him, the closeness of their friendship will continue to give the friends false hope that they have a chance together. He is unintentionally leading them on, wasting their time, and even breaking their hearts. He is naive to believe he can prevent someone from falling for him just by stating a "happily engaged" disclaimer the first time they ever speak. There is much more to say, but I would talk forever if I didn't pace myself. Any opinions so far would be much appreciated.
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Today, 08:01 AM
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#4 (permalink)
| | Member ?Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Illy Philly
Posts: 433
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Quote: | He is an affair waiting to happen.
Posted via Mobile Device |
How so? He hasn't done anything wrong. To the OP... you pretty much described me, with the difference being that i do see when a woman is flirting, those i keep at a distance. But i have a bunch of gal pals, who use me as a shoulder to cry on. My wife knows about these women, some have friended her. The biggest concern i have hear is that these women don't seem interested in you. To me, that's a huge RED FLAG. I've had gal pals go out of their way to befriend my wife, just showing that nothing is being kept in secret, and they are not mysterious. But on your future hubby's part, until he actual does something that violates your trust, i don't see this being a big issue. Yes, boundaries should be present in a marriage, but these connections were already made prior to your marriage, and as logn as they aren't inappropriate in the grand scheme of things, i don't see it as an issue. Tread carefully on how you approach this one. You will come of as jealous and insecure if you botch the way you handle this.
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Today, 09:44 AM
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#8 (permalink)
| | Registered User ?Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 5
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Thank you for your responses so far. Please do explain why you have these opinions, if you haven't, because it would help. I will also show this thread to future hubby when we're done, and it helps him to see as many viewpoints and ways of explaining as possible. He wants to make his own thread as well from his own point of view. We are both committed to working on this.Yes, I agree that there are huge red flags here. I should have noted, I have had plenty of conversations with him about ALL of this, and more, throughout our whole relationship. I must say that he is wonderful. Our conversations are always about understanding the other, and not about defending a side. He never gets defensive, but he does fail to understand at times. Every time I bring up all of these things, he simply asks me, "What should I do?" I just didn't know what to tell him. He is willing to give up female friendships. He puts up no argument. I'm most important to him. He says he has never thought of his friendships this way before, and if what I'm saying is really how it is, it makes him not want to have female friends. It really freaks him out! But I have felt bad about perhaps asking him to give up female friendships, because I feel like it would be punishing him when he did nothing wrong. His last relationship was with a very insecure, jealous, controlling woman. He was used to hearing these things from her and assumed it was because she was messed up. But now that he's hearing it from me, someone who is the polar opposite of his last relationship, and also reading it from other sources I've been sharing with him lately, he is understanding it differently. I was also unsure of why I had a problem with these friendships, and didn't want to take action until I understood my own feelings. We both came into this relationship being very naive about relationships. We both thought that as long as there is no physical affair, nothing else one does could possibly be wrong (and now I am a little ahead of him in learning differently). But that's why I was very confused as to why I was having hurt feelings over these relationships if I wasn't, in fact, insecure. In which case I shouldn't be controlling him to ease my own insecurities. However, I have finally come to the conclusion that it's not about jealousy or distrust, it is more about honoring the exclusive commitment we have made to each other as partners, upholding decorum, and not unintentionally hurting these female friends who are getting wrong ideas. And I agree that no one is immune from cheating, so it is also about protecting our future from unanticipated threats. I'm just not feeling threatened right now because, from what I've heard of these women, they are no competition at all. I am a pretty awesome girlfriend if I do say so. But it's true, we are at risk if this keep going on. Please send more opinions, you are all being very helpful.
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Today, 10:21 AM
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#12 (permalink)
| | Member ?Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 99
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Quote: | We are a couple in our 20's, have known each other 4-5 years, and been a couple for about 2 years. We are best friends, super compatible, and happy together. We've known we wanted to be married since the beginning of our relationship. But issues keep coming up about his female friends that cause me a lot of pain and put strain on our relationship, and I'm very confused. Are these friendships appropriate in our case? Should we be doing something differently? This is my first relationship, so a lot of my feelings are new and confusing. However, I have come to a few firm conclusions about myself. I am not an insecure, jealous, or controlling person. I also trust completely that he would never cheat or intend anything unfaithful. I want him to be able to have female friends if that's possible. I want to add to his life, not take away from it. I would feel bad if he had to give up any friendships, especially his old high school friendships from before we met. Here is what I have come up with. Pros for him having female friends: -He grew up among sisters, and has always maintained friendships with females because he feels more comfortable with it.
-He prefers female friends because he's found that they make better friends. Male friends seem to care more about his entertainment value than anything deeper.I don't think this is necessarily the case, I'm a female with a male best friend. He has always been there for me, I get long better with males for the most part because I have found that females can be to self centered and petty.
-He doesn't consider it a friendship unless there is considerable depth to the relationship. Anything else is just acquaintanceship, which doesn't interest him.
-He's not in it for his ego (to be flattered by female attention), he just seeks meaningful platonic friendships, which are easier for him to find in females.
-The first thing he tells new female friends when he meets them is that he is in a happy relationship, he is looking for a platonic friend only, and if that is not her intention too, they can't be friends. Cons for him having female friends: -He doesn't have a good sense of appropriate boundaries, or why they should exist. Really, most adults are able to grasp the concept that appropriate boundaries exist to prevent misunderstands and to avoid giving out the wrong signals.He treats and is treated by his female friends exactly the same as a romantic partner, except that there is no holding hands/kissing/sex. There are no other physical or emotional boundaries.Well if they are treating him like a romantic partner then it is not just a friendship. What exactly do you mean by being treated as a romantic partner?
-We have tried to put some boundaries in place to see if it helps, with little success. They feel so unnatural to him, he forgets how to act, and why he should act that way. He simply doesn't pick up on all the subtleties (even the UNsubtleties) that should prompt boundaries.So what boundaries have you put into place that he seems to have trouble with?
-He is very caring and generous by nature, which is wonderful, but often causes female friends to become too dependent on him. He discusses deep personal topics with female friends, offers a lot of advice, helps them with their problems, and serves as a shoulder to cry on. He says that women often confide and vent to him about their personal problems, especially their current relationships or exes. He is also often asked to help them move, fix their belongings, escort them or pick them up from dangerous areas.
Does he seem to really need the ego boost of being everyone's savior? Because this sounds like a red flag to me. Once you are married how are you doing to lead a normal married life if he is always off 'saving' another woman? These things have no deeper meaning to him than just being nice. So he often finds himself in female friendships where he is much more important to her than she is to him.
-He's really innocent. He is oblivious to flirtation and other signs of sexual or romantic interest unless they are very, and I mean VERY, overt. He does not catch hints. He does not read between lines. He does not pick up clues. He doesn't realize a woman is interested or developing interest unless she makes it very obvious, usually an actual verbal confession. Two separate times as a teenager, two different girls have "broken up" with him while he had no idea they were even a couple. He is utterly clueless, and knows this about himself.I have a really hard time believing that an adult doesn't know when they are being flirted with. How did you get him to ask you out? Did you have to flirt a little or a lot?
-He has female friends from before we met, but also new female friends from after the start of our relationship. None of these female friends have made any attempt to befriend me, even after he continually suggests that they befriend me.Major redflag that these women may see you as a competitor I have also tried to make opportunities for them to talk to me. I would like to be friends with them. Our only mutual female friends are ones I knew first, or ones we both met before we were in a relationship.
-He has been actively, and independently, seeking new female friends throughout our relationship.It concerns me that he actively seeks female friends, it is one thing to become friends with someone at work or he sees on a regular basis but to go out looking for female friends is another. Just how many female friends does he have? He doesn't try to keep me from these friends or hide them in any way, but it is nearly impossible for me to physically go hang out with them or bring them to our place, for reasons beyond our control right now.
-I am positive that at least some of his female friends have feelings for him. He rarely believes me when I try to warn him that his "friend" doesn't fit the proper role of a friend anymore, even though my suspicions have been dramatically revealed correct before, which makes me feel like my input is being invalidated and unfairly dismissed.So when you alert him to a potential problem he ignores you? that is a redflag.
-I am hurt by this perpetual situation. The lack of boundaries does bother me a great deal. It doesn't seem proper.Because it's not proper The physical closeness and contact just seems wrong to me.That is because it IS wrong, he is in a relationship with you, you are the only female he should have physical closeness with He has successfully toned that down a great deal with his newer friends because he recognized that it gives female friends the wrong idea. But he reverts right back to his old ways when he sees his old friends, out of habit and their reinforcement. The emotional intimacy also seems very inappropriate. And the exclusivity especially bothers me. I feel like our relationship is not being honored and respected, by both him and his female friends.So you have told him you are not comfortable with this and he continues to do it? When you tell your partner that something makes you uncomfortable or is an issue for you and they don't correct the situation then to me that is a red flag.
-I am worried for the female friends, because if they do have feelings for him, the closeness of their friendship will continue to give the friends false hope that they have a chance together. He is unintentionally leading them on, wasting their time, and even breaking their hearts. He is naive to believe he can prevent someone from falling for him just by stating a "happily engaged" disclaimer the first time they ever speak. There is much more to say, but I would talk forever if I didn't pace myself. Any opinions so far would be much appreciated. |
If you were talking about one or maybe two close long time female friends it might be a different issue, but your post makes it seem as if your boyfriend collects female friends the way most men collect power tools or baseball cards. Does your boyfriend have any male friends, or is it only female? Have you ever sat home alone while he was out with one or more of the female friends?
Last edited by SadieBrown; Today at 12:20 PM.
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Today, 10:42 AM
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#14 (permalink)
| | Member ?Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 99
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Quote: However, I have finally come to the conclusion that it's not about jealousy or distrust, it is more about honoring the exclusive commitment we have made to each other as partners, upholding decorum, and not unintentionally hurting these female friends who are getting wrong ideas.Exactly, I'm glad you understand all that. And I agree that no one is immune from cheating, so it is also about protecting our future from unanticipated threats. Good, I'm glad you realize that, granted some people are a lot more immune than others, but I think the best you can get is 99% immuneI'm just not feeling threatened right now because, from what I've heard of these women, they are no competition at all. I am a pretty awesome girlfriend if I do say so.Don't get to smug and comfortable, have you seen the woman Arnold cheated on Maria with?? I'm just saying. . . .
and what do you mean by "what I've heard of these women"? What have you heard about them and from who? But it's true, we are at risk if this keep going on.Please send more opinions, you are all being very helpful. |
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| Source: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/26309-my-future-husbands-female-friendships-appropriate.html
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